Anonymous

Another New Book Featuring TR7 & 8s

The all purpose forum for any TR7/8 related topics.
Alec Pringle
Scuttle Shaker
Posts: 72
Joined: 17 Jun 2008 23:48
Location:
Contact:

Postby Alec Pringle » 05 May 2009 17:30

"<i>Let me see if I understand this. Are we saying that professional writers and publishers are NOT getting feedback from the TR7 community and, thus, rehashing the old with all it's misconceptions and errors</i>?"

I think my post was clear enough . . . "Meanwhile, since the publication of the first ‘Original TR7/8’ book Bill had received absolutely no critical commentaries from the Wedge community – not a sausage" . . . can't say it much clearer than that, can I ?

"<i>Are we intimating that the one true source for current, valid, original TR7 articles is here on these forums</i>?"

No, I wouldn't suggest anything of the sort. Yes there is good factual information appearing on motoring forums, there's also a great deal of uninformed and inaccurate opinion. Which is a polite way of saying . . . drivel. There have been plenty of commendable magazine articles over the years, and also a lot of drivel. David Knowles' book is, I think, another commendable piece of work.

"<i>Are the publishing houses even aware we exist? Or, do they poo-poo our amateurism as not worth the trouble of viewing</i>?"

Publishing houses are in the business of publishing books and/or magazines. I can't imagine that they're overly concerned about this or any other motoring forum. Why should they be ? Generally speaking they're publishers first and foremost, rather than old car nuts. They spot what they consider to be a gap in the market, and commission an author to produce a book - to a given brief, specification, budget and timescale. The latter two items in particular may be less realistic than one might wish. But it's a hard commercial world. Dog eats dog, and devil takes the hindmost.

Bill Piggott would be only too delighted to receive all the assistance we can offer. That's about as fair an offer as one could hope for. It's up to us Wedge enthusiasts as to whether or not we wish to assist - to the benefit of all, and the marque.

I can't comment on the attitudes of authors with whom I am not personally acquainted. From personal experience I can assure you that the likes of Graham Robson, Bill Piggott and David Knowles are always open to new information and ideas.

Meanwhile, for anyone interested in the whole TR range, I still reckon the new book is a bargain !

Cheers,

Alec

Workshop Help
TRiffic
Posts: 1891
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 23:52
Location: Worldwide

Postby Workshop Help » 05 May 2009 18:58

Thank you for your candor. However, having viewed the literary offerings on the TR7 for over three decades, I find my experiences to be diametrically opposed to the findings offered by the various authors and commentators. As such, and for free, I will compose my own technical prose for this community for our shared benefit.

Drivel?, yes, call it what you may and as you wish. But, I for one will not patronage any further product of the publishing world with regard to the Triumph TR7. I have learned I can do it better my self!

This is MY Declaration of Independence.

Mildred Hargis

PeterTR7V8
TRemendous
Posts: 2914
Joined: 10 Jun 2008 02:22
Location: New Zealand
Contact:

Postby PeterTR7V8 » 05 May 2009 20:06

I always assumed that auto books were like cook books where the writer had tried out all the recipes first to make sure they worked.

Image
Never say die. At least not while you're still breathing.

FI Spyder
TRemendous
Posts: 8920
Joined: 03 Jul 2006 19:54
Location: Canada

Postby FI Spyder » 05 May 2009 23:20

I bought Bill Piggott's book because I saw it for sale, new, at a book store for $20. This was before I seriously considered buying a TR7 as I had two Spitfires. It rekindled my enthusiasm I had for the TR7 I had in the seventies and led me to eventually buying one (now two). I used it as my bible though noting his entry that robbin's egg blue wasn't likely an original colour on the oil cannister was false as my original untouched Spider had it (50% of left anyway) as well as 50% of paint left on jubilee clips was same colour. Although it may have errors, inevitable given the state of affairs in the British Manufacturing industry as it imploded, it's still the best book out there (haven't read Untold Story yet) on the TR7 and I for one would like to thank him for his efforts. Compiling info for a book must be a massive undertaking as mentioned by Chris and I'm sure experienced by John in his DVD, a similar experience.

I think Chris and Odd should get together and do a book with pictures supplied by jclay and annecdotes by Hasbeen. Now that would be a book to buy.[:)]


TR7 Spider - 1978 Spifire - 1976 Spitfire - 1988 Tercel 4X4 - Kali on Integra - 1991 Integra
Image

Alec Pringle
Scuttle Shaker
Posts: 72
Joined: 17 Jun 2008 23:48
Location:
Contact:

Postby Alec Pringle » 05 May 2009 23:26

Hi Mildred,

I'm probably being obtuse here, but I'm not sure just what point you're trying to make . . . .

We started off by discussing BP's latest offering, and it's probably fair to say that in terms of its TR7/8 content it's not as good as it could or should be - and I've endeavoured to explain why, as I understand it from BP himself, and how a future book could and should be improved. As in more input from Wedge gurus, for example.

Quite how this expands to include three decades of "literary offerings" escapes me. It's nigh on 35 years since I first drove a TR7, and since then I've read an awful lot of magazine articles and books relating to 7s and 8s. There aren't many cars that have had such a mixed press, here in the UK and around the world. For sure press commentators and motoring journalists have offered wildly differing opinions on the merits and demerits of Wedges, and so have established and respected motoring authors. Unanimity of opinion there is not, and never has been.

The diversity of views is hardly surprising - BL in the 70s was a nightmare organisation, most of its products flawed and underdeveloped, despite the flashes of inspiration frequently evident. The successes of the cars in competition were achieved in spite of the fundamental flaws, not as a result of a coherent design package. The TR7 and TR8 were not exceptions.

But now we're talking history, something usually written by the victors. I don't see books, or even magazine articles, about old sports cars as "literary offerings" or "technical prose". Written years after the events, either they're factual articles about the history of the marque, or technical manuals on how to do practical stuff.

OK, there's the odd exception - get me going on the 1980 Le Mans saga, and that's another story. Don't expect total objectivity from the foot soldiers who fought to the last round, and then fixed bayonets.

But how on earth can you be "diametrically opposed to the findings offered by the various authors and commentators" when their views are so diverse ? Sorry, but that doesn't stack up !

Publishers are businessmen, just like car manufacturers, don't condemn them out of hand for doing their job.

Cheers,

Alec

tr8
Wedgista
Posts: 1172
Joined: 20 Apr 2004 16:20
Location: Canada
Contact:

Postby tr8 » 06 May 2009 03:16

As Alec has offered to bridge the gap and collect corrections, I think it would be great for those who have spent the time checking the books in detail to give thier comments to Alec.

Perhaps this way when the next edition is ordered there will be time to assemble the corrections within the unreasonable cost and time constraints that will likely be part of a revision.

Thanks for the POSITIVE gesture Alec.

Paul

Wayne S
Swagester
Posts: 924
Joined: 20 Dec 2005 13:38
Location: United Kingdom
Contact:

Postby Wayne S » 06 May 2009 08:42

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Century Gothic, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tr8</i>

As Alec has offered to bridge the gap and collect corrections, I think it would be great for those who have spent the time checking the books in detail to give thier comments to Alec.

Perhaps this way when the next edition is ordered there will be time to assemble the corrections within the unreasonable cost and time constraints that will likely be part of a revision.

Thanks for the POSITIVE gesture Alec.

Paul
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Totally agree - this is the chance to put forward our corrections and views on a book and is a luxury not afforded to most sections of the media these days. So all those who have comment to make should take this opportunity to set the records straight and ensure that there is at least one book out there that speaks the truth.

There is a big difference between the likes of Bill Piggotts "historical" books and a workshop manual detailing how to work on the cars. I doubt he would ever try and replicate anything like the Roger Williams books for instance. They are a different breed of book and as Peter says are always best written in cookbook style.

Books offer information to potential new owners and help to document the cars for future generations long after the contents of a forum have dissapeared due to server failure or some such problem.

Publishers need to be very careful when lifting resources from forums. There is no quality control on here and the majority of us are essentially amateurs. There is a big difference between an opinion offered to another owner on a forum to "try out" or a view point based on fading memories to the sort of factual information that is safe to publish in a book that will be around for years. Of course once a book is published there is no opportunity to comment or correct as we are able to do on a forum.

Publishers often dont have the financial resources to put aside to sifting through forums and filtering the drivel from the gems. The best way to set the records straight is to feedback via TR Action (the TR Register's magazine), Alec here or the registrar Richard Connew. Malcom Paris often used to struggle for content from owners whereas earlier TR enthusiasts are a very much more anoraks when it comes to their vehicles history and factual information.

We need to stand up and offer factual information based on evidence if we are to help contribute to these books, not take a negative attitude. We are after all the custodians of these vehicles!




<b>2.0 Litre DHC Grinnall
Red 4.0 Litre V8 DHC Grinnall (with huuuuuge arches...!)</b>
Image

paul w
Wedgista
Posts: 1421
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 20:36
Location: United Kingdom
Contact:

Postby paul w » 07 May 2009 01:12

Blimey!A few days away from this site,an'everyones gone full on polytickle!
Lighten up,its just a book,written by a car nut....
....a falible human being,is everyone else always right?!


ok,ok,I'm ALWAYS right!('cept when i is wrong....most of the time)

See ya',Paul.

ImageImageImageImageImage

Alec Pringle
Scuttle Shaker
Posts: 72
Joined: 17 Jun 2008 23:48
Location:
Contact:

Postby Alec Pringle » 13 May 2009 19:06

Just raising this topic back up the list, in the hope that a few more folks might give it some thought. It would be good to have some constructive observations in due course . . . .

Cheers,

Alec

Beans
TRemendous
Posts: 7822
Joined: 15 Mar 2006 19:29
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Postby Beans » 13 May 2009 20:27

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Century Gothic, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Alec Pringle</i>

Just raising this topic back up the list...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Thx for that as I missed it when it was first posted.
Will go through the "Original Triumph TR7 & TR8" book with a Johnny Foreigner view [;)]
When time allows that is [B)]

<center>Image
<font color="blue"><i>1981 TR7 FHC Sprint (better known as 't Kreng)
1981 TR7 DHC (now completely dismantled)
Also a 1980 TR7 DHC, 1980 TR7 DHC FI, 1981 TR7 FHC</font id="blue">
<font color="red">http://tr7beans.blogspot.com/</i></font id="red"></center>

Wayne S
Swagester
Posts: 924
Joined: 20 Dec 2005 13:38
Location: United Kingdom
Contact:

Postby Wayne S » 13 May 2009 22:47

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Century Gothic, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by paul w</i>

Blimey!A few days away from this site,an'everyones gone full on polytickle!
Lighten up,its just a book,written by a car nut....
....a falible human being,is everyone else always right?!


ok,ok,I'm ALWAYS right!('cept when i is wrong....most of the time)

See ya',Paul.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]

<b>2.0 Litre DHC Grinnall
Red 4.0 Litre V8 DHC Grinnall (with huuuuuge arches...!)</b>
Image

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 60 guests